"60s garage music" versus "pop culture"

[axel]

Actually you're wrong , there were radio shows like Twen Club ; Club 16 ; Mittwochsparty ( wednesdayparty ) on german public radio before Beat Club and soon after Beat Club started Beat , Beat , Beat began airing on tv as well . But definitely the biggest thing for beat fans was Radio Luxemburg on medium wave radio . H-J Klitsch's book Shakin' All Over gives a good overview on the german beatscene and what it meant to be a teenager back then .

Well, "wrong" is a bit strong maybe:

* "Club 16" started in 1967.
* "Twen Club" was a dance club in Bremen that opened in late 1963. It seems to have become a radio program later on. But I can't find any reference to that before 1966.
* "Mittwochsparty" started in 1959, but I can't find anything about its content. It seems that groups of teenagers decided on the playlists, which is interesting. But, as the name says, it was only on Wednesdays.

AND those were regional stations. And probably the only ones nation-wide.
Moreover until 1968 the "Beat Club" was broadcasted only once a month for half an hour (!). So it really can't be said there was a lot going on, and definitely nothing compared to Top 40 radio stations.
Every account of people who grew up during that time says that the mass media matched the demand in no way.

H.-J. Klitsch's work is one amazing book and a must-have for anybody interested in the subject. The German TBM, so to speak. Sadly it's only in German.

 

[axel]

Well well well,... as flawed as my approach might be, there's basically just one thing I want to say:

Mass consumption, mass media and mass popularity have nothing to say about the significance of a certain music (or anything for that matter). If 10 people really get excited about it that's popular and "pop" in my opinion.
60s garage music is/was pop music in its purest form, and that's why people will always come back to it. There are many songs that were hits in the sixties which mean nothing to younger generations, whereas young people (if only a few) get all excited about some totally obscure stuff like the Keggs.
So much about significance.
And, yeah well, so much about over-analysis.

 

[Don Julio]

Well well well,... as flawed as my approach might be, there's basically just one thing I want to say:

Mass consumption, mass media and mass popularity have nothing to say about the significance of a certain music (or anything for that matter). If 10 people really get excited about it that's popular and "pop" in my opinion. 60s garage music is/was pop music in its purest form, and that's why people will always come back to it. There are many songs that were hits in the sixties which mean nothing to younger generations, whereas young people (if only a few) get all excited about some totally obscure stuff like the Keggs.
So much about significance. And, yeah well, so much about over-analysis.

Well, using the American pop paradigm again, you're only "significant" if (a) you're popular, or (b) a consensus of critics/tastemakers deign you to be significant. '60s garage does not slot into either category.

Ten people "excited" about some unknown record made 50 years ago is not a part of the pop paradigms. It's archaeology, romance, elitism, anthropology, and a wine-tasting contest, a minor subset of the (b) category above. In some cases, the enthusiasms of a few can eventually morph into (b), e.g. pre-war country blues.

 

[Lee de Parade]

Is this what you're yapping about?

"If a 45 plays in a garage and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

 

[Don Julio]

In England, during the late 50s early 60s rock and roll meant Elvis, Little Richard, Gene Vincent, Bill Haley etc. From late 1962 when The Beatles and other teenage Liverpool groups started releasing 45s I suppose the term rock and roll didn't fit with the new sound so the genre 'merseybeat' was used to describe the music these young combos were making. In other parts of Britain it was regionalised (ie) Brum beat or just simply called beat. One of the music papers was called 'Teen Beat'

This is something I really don't understand.

Americans for the most part didn't (or don't) draw any sharp distinction from '50s rock and roll and what came later. The term "English music" was used around 64-65, but "rock and roll" was still the most widely used term. Nobody felt the need to fossilize the term and say, "Only music made or played in the style of 1954-59 can be properly called 'rock and roll'". This is totally a European concept. I'm guessing it's a function of what could be generalized as L'Academie francaise effect, where there are "official" definitions of terms, and it's considered lazy and bad form for meanings to drift over time. But this is precisely what happens all the time within popular culture.

 

[tom kirby]

Thank you

 

[EXPO67]

I'm happy with what I wrote and I'm sticking to it. Just out of interest I looked at the introduction of 'The Tapestry Of Delights' and here's an extract from it.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

 

[bosshoss]

Is this what you're yapping about?

"If a 45 plays in a garage and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

There must be a way of proving this beyond doubt. For example, sound is movement of air particles therefore it would create a certain amount of heat. You could measure the air temperature in the garage before playing the 45, and again after playing it. If the temperature was a little higher afterwards, then that would be proof that it made a sound. Adjusted for external variables such as global warming, of course.

Maybe this deserves a topic of its own?

 

[wildpaws]

Thank you

@ DON JULIO: Double thank you!!

@EXPO67: In the time range you cite, "Merseybeat" was considered a sub-genre of rock and roll in most of the US, there were certainly plenty of recordings still hitting the charts that were not Merseybeat oriented. I can recall many different types of rock&roll being on the top 100 charts at the same time, we didn't break it all down to each specific sub-genre. There was on overall top 100, R&B charts, jazz charts, classical charts, but I don't ever recall seeing a Merseybeat top 100 in Billboard.
Clyde

 

[Frantic]

Adjusted for external variables such as global warming, of course.

aren't they calling that CLIMATE CHANGE these days?

 

[beccabear67]

In the '70s out here we might call The Beatles etc. 'British Rock' although I understand they were called beat groups in Europe originally. Stuff like Chuck Berry etc. we would've referred to as '50s Rock'. By the early '80s everything was lumped together as 'Classic Rock' because I remember station KZOK's tv advertisement saying it only played that and in the background you could hear The Who and Joe Walsh. Other distinctions that might be made were for 'AM Rock' and 'FM Rock', The Monkees or Archies would be AM and Pink Floyd or Jethro Tull FM. Sometimes 'FM Rock' was called 'Headphone Rock' and sometimes 'Stoner Rock'. Disco and Rock were very seperate while I was growing up, and there was a Funk subcategory that continued post-Disco, but in Europe Disco meant the place you went to and not the kind of music, except in L.A. at Rodney Bingenheimer's where they played stuff we never would have called 'Disco'. I don't really remember Glam as a term; that music was just lumped in with 'Heavy Rock' generally here. Now 'Heavy Rock' was your Black Sabbath and Deep Purple, sort of a subset of 'Stoner Rock' and yet not of 'Headphone Rock'. If it was loud but you really didn't want to hear it on headphones that seemed to make it 'Heavy Rock'. Make sense? What we called '60s garage rock was usually nothing because we didn't know it had existed, but if something did surface it would just be lumped in with 'Classic Rock'. 'Punk Rock' was some arty marketing thing out of NY and London that got dropped at some point, switched to 'New Wave' for a bit and then that label too got phased out by the powers that be wherever they were, and whoever survived survived as just 'Rock'. Bo Diddley was Rock (whenever he wasn't blues), Johnny & The Hurricanes were Rock, The Beatles were Rock, Bob Seger was Rock, AC-DC were Rock, The Clash were Rock, Hall & Oates were Rock, The Subsonics were Rock. It was pretty much all 'just' Rock most of the time. There wasn't all that much to say about it usually but these are the distinctions in giving a label to something which I remember. Beat would have meant something connected to the Beatnicks who we only knew about probably because of Maynard G. Krebbs who recited 'beat poetry' on Dobie Gillis reruns before he turned into Gilligan.

 

[axel]

Is this what you're yapping about?

"If a 45 plays in a garage and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Is this supposed to be a kôan? Can you see the difference to "the clap of one hand"? I suggest you delve deeper into the meaning of nothingness, bodhi.

 

[axel]

Ummmmmm, so it's all "classic rock"? Great! Why not say it's all music? Or sound?
Or noise? Or even better white noise?
I can identify with that: white noise & 45s playing in a garage without anyone listening.

Here's where it all comes together. From 01:10 onwards (for about 15 seconds):

 

[axel]

There must be a way of proving this beyond doubt. For example, sound is movement of air particles therefore it would create a certain amount of heat. You could measure the air temperature in the garage before playing the 45, and again after playing it. If the temperature was a little higher afterwards, then that would be proof that it made a sound. Adjusted for external variables such as global warming, of course.

Maybe this deserves a topic of its own?

You could also set up a cassette recorder, play the 45, walk out, come back after 5 minutes, and listen to the cassette tape.
And if you place the stereo at one end of the room, and the cassette recorder at the other, you can also have a nice side effect by turning even a Michael Jackson record into garage music.

 

[axel]

And if this here ends up in a flag waving battle (and I can see it comin) I'd gladly go down fighting for this one, especially if it's 2 against 189:

 

[mansson66]

It's incredibly ignorant and uninformed to call "merseybeat" and The Beatles a "completely new sound"(in the Tapestry of Delights text). The Beatles were "invented" by Buddy Holly & the Crickets.

 

[mansson66]

Btw musicians never make up the tags. That's invented by others, who try to understand the music - and often fails, because well... they aren't the ones who make the music.
Also: musicians who actually make up tags for their own music generally suck. In my opinion of course. But it's a very educated opinion

 

[tom kirby]

aren't they calling that CLIMATE CHANGE these days?

Cyclical Climate Change - It started in a Garage in mid-Michigan around the time of Del Shannon, however, wasn't detected until after the Brits Invaded.

 

[Don Julio]

Btw musicians never make up the tags. That's invented by others, who try to understand the music - and often fails, because well... they aren't the ones who make the music.
Also: musicians who actually make up tags for their own music generally suck. In my opinion of course. But it's a very educated opinion

The Elevators tagged their own music "psychedelic rock." The Groupies tagged theirs "abstract rock." But yeah, that's generally true. The categories are necessary for marketing the music. Salesmen needed terms like "race records" as quick identifiers to target specific buyers. It's pretty much the same thing today with record dealers peddling old 45s and 78s.

 

[Lee de Parade]

Is this supposed to be a kôan? Can you see the difference to "the clap of one hand"? I suggest you delve deeper into the meaning of nothingness, bodhi.

I dunno, I'm afraid that if I let my ego die, I will start writing songs like Imagine.