New comp: The Dark Side – 30 Sixties Garage Punk and Psych Monsters (CD/2LP)
- Thread starter massb
- Start date
Aint pickin' on the dude. Only the phenomenon.
I would never "pick" on unlicensed comps. Without them most of us wouldn't be here.
I only react when someone smugly CLAIMS they're licensed.
Outside_Lookin_in
G45 Legend
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2014
Just to make things unequivocal, yes, it was Crypt on the receiving end of the criticism, but the bile was coming from the defending end: the criticism of Crypt was measured.
keb darge
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2014
BBE did licence the bulk of the tunes. They have to do that to get them into "high street" stores, even though they don't really exist anymore. The notes are mostly scraped from the net indeed. During the process we did find the Illusions of "City of People" fame, and will have new photos, etc for the next comp. Hopefully Tom will have the odd unreleased tune too. He is hooking up with an other member of the band to get more stuff for us. His brother who he set the band up with is unfortunately dead though. I am new to this garage world. I will confess I am a disco jockey first, and in order to put food on the table I do these comps to introduce my current love to the general public. BBE get their comps into places that others will struggle to reach because of their high standing in the wankers music world.
keb darge
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2014
That is indeed true. My main reason was that I could get bookings off the back of this. I got sick of being asked to play funk and soul as it no longer excites me. This stuff excites me and as I make my living as a disco jockey, and am now too old to get a proper job, I used this to try and get bookings I would be excited by. BBE taught me years ago of the benefit of excessive trumpet blowing.
keb darge
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2014
I know nothing of Harry Fox. I do know that BBE and the parent company K7 in Germany took a couple of years to clear the final tracks. They also rejected about 20 tracks because they could not find the people concerned. We also did get some stuff from the bands themselves. So I am pretty sure they did properly licence at least some of the tracks.
paul messis
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2011
- Location
- West Sussex
As a young collector of this music, I think I will add my two cents.
On a personal level for me I personally can't stand the way things are going with "the scene" it all feels very much like the fun is being slowly taken out of it, I agree pretty much in unison to what Moptop Mike states in his above posts.... but on a more personal level and I am sure some of the guys collecting since the 80s probably feel the same way, it just kinda feels that the thing we've all loved and which we've invested out hearts and souls and money too has been completely hijacked.
In my case, garage comps started me on my way around 2002 when I was 16 and pretty much a year or two later I began to collect 45s, NO-ONE and I repeat no-one in my universe and (remember this was somewhat pre-internet as we know it times ) knew or cared for this music and that lasted some years, but for me, it was my entire life, I related to the experience of garage band music personally, it means a lot to me, the songs resonate on a level I could only call spiritual.
Fast forward a bit in London and a few young bands start citing garage bands as reference points and already it felt the tide was turning (Many of these groups now don't even play garage band music anymore)
fast forward more and we're seeing garage on TV adverts, we're seeing records which only 10 years ago were affordable selling for absolutely stupid money and we're seeing a rise of folks coming to this music that is watering it down in a very very slight way.... the genre is losing its edge by completely accidental reasons.
The other day I was thinking about some of the 45s now selling for £2k on Ebay.... its is honestly dumb and is now reaching really stupid heights, I am certainly feeling that folks who lack the passion but have the cash are buying these 45s now and for me as a person who cares deeply for this music.... the FUN has now totally gone for me.... its somewhat tainted due to the "fashionable" way its all being marketed and sold as.
I still buy 45s when I can, but I can't honestly see the point spending over $700 for a record which you could get easily a few years ago.... think about it for a second what $700 bucks COULD actually buy you
Also I am friends with a few of the "elder" American 45 collectors and the sad thing is, many of these guys have had to SELL beloved 45s they found in the late 70s/early 80s just in order to live.... One of my closest friends had to sell his collection to fund a law court, each 45 he sold was a reluctant sell I know.
it's all become turd!!!
On a personal level for me I personally can't stand the way things are going with "the scene" it all feels very much like the fun is being slowly taken out of it, I agree pretty much in unison to what Moptop Mike states in his above posts.... but on a more personal level and I am sure some of the guys collecting since the 80s probably feel the same way, it just kinda feels that the thing we've all loved and which we've invested out hearts and souls and money too has been completely hijacked.
In my case, garage comps started me on my way around 2002 when I was 16 and pretty much a year or two later I began to collect 45s, NO-ONE and I repeat no-one in my universe and (remember this was somewhat pre-internet as we know it times ) knew or cared for this music and that lasted some years, but for me, it was my entire life, I related to the experience of garage band music personally, it means a lot to me, the songs resonate on a level I could only call spiritual.
Fast forward a bit in London and a few young bands start citing garage bands as reference points and already it felt the tide was turning (Many of these groups now don't even play garage band music anymore)
fast forward more and we're seeing garage on TV adverts, we're seeing records which only 10 years ago were affordable selling for absolutely stupid money and we're seeing a rise of folks coming to this music that is watering it down in a very very slight way.... the genre is losing its edge by completely accidental reasons.
The other day I was thinking about some of the 45s now selling for £2k on Ebay.... its is honestly dumb and is now reaching really stupid heights, I am certainly feeling that folks who lack the passion but have the cash are buying these 45s now and for me as a person who cares deeply for this music.... the FUN has now totally gone for me.... its somewhat tainted due to the "fashionable" way its all being marketed and sold as.
I still buy 45s when I can, but I can't honestly see the point spending over $700 for a record which you could get easily a few years ago.... think about it for a second what $700 bucks COULD actually buy you
Also I am friends with a few of the "elder" American 45 collectors and the sad thing is, many of these guys have had to SELL beloved 45s they found in the late 70s/early 80s just in order to live.... One of my closest friends had to sell his collection to fund a law court, each 45 he sold was a reluctant sell I know.
it's all become turd!!!
Frantic
G45 Legend
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
But then there's plenty of records that used to sell for $700 that can now be had cheaply or easily.
paul messis
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2011
- Location
- West Sussex
this is true Frantic there are hundreds which are still affordable and bargains can be had with the great 45s hidden from "public view" so to speak but 8 times outta 10, it'd make more sense getting a mortgage just for a 45 these days.
Rythmn Boy
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2016
- Location
- Darwin, NT
Sad stories, but they couldn't sell them for any meaningful amount if there was no demand
Northeastbeast
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2012
I genuinely can't think of much I'd rather spend $700 on than a fucking cool 45 off my wants list, to be honest.
If I didn't spend it on records, I'd only go wasting it on my wife and kids.
Don't get the view that the fun is being taking out of "the scene" either. I used to be the only person in town collecting this type of music, now pretty much every weekend there is a decent club night option in town where I can here decent music. Now, I rarely get out to those nights but it is good to see, in my opinion.
If I didn't spend it on records, I'd only go wasting it on my wife and kids.
Don't get the view that the fun is being taking out of "the scene" either. I used to be the only person in town collecting this type of music, now pretty much every weekend there is a decent club night option in town where I can here decent music. Now, I rarely get out to those nights but it is good to see, in my opinion.
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
- Location
- The shores of southern CT
The best examples of any kind of product are going to be sought-after by those individuals who have the means and wherewithall to do so. Paul's viewpoint is that more people are coming into the collecting and appreciation realm for the music we champion at G45, and that also brings in the folks who, in some views, drive the price beyond that which is affordable or perceived value in order to obtain a record.
Keeping a 'scene' insular is precisely what prevents further discovery and brick-walls anyone who wants to learn more beyond generic aspects. Insularity (if that is a term) is what I met up with when I started back around 1980. I wanted to collect original pressings. Pebbles comps sounded like total shit after the first few spins And Boulders.... However, information as to values, quantities, and other inside knowledge was kept to those more veteran and experienced collectors. I got taken to the cleaners as they say more often than not for the first few years. i guess I had to prove my worth AND learn on my own by being observant and meticulous. By 1986, I was more comfortable shelling out several hundred bucks for a most wanted 45. I did not do that often, either - my selections were carefully considered. And that is what I chose to spend my extra money on - not a new or fancy used car, vacations, musical gear, what have you. The best examples of any genre will continue to sell for stratospheric prices and I find nothing wrong with that. There are many 45s I will never be able to obtain because I cannot afford them. But there are many cheaper examples to collect that I sometimes enjoy even more than the rarified classic.
I guess my 'peeve; would be the fact that far too many people think they have all the answers and can be an expert merely by whatever they find / or can't find via the internet. Experience of decades is usually dismissed as irrelevant, since we now live in the era of immediacy. As exemplified our recent G45 joinee - he's lowered his ransom price by a thousand dollars, but greed always overrules rationality for these insecure types.
As for current prices paid, I agree there are many bargains out there. In my view, the Freedom Five 45 recently achieved near $600 for a VG copy. I would consider that a steal at that price, knowing how rare it is, and how much I had to offer in trade to get my collection copy over a decade ago. And, yes, there are a certain sect of DJ's out there who routinely overpay for a record because their huge scene ego needs to be fed.
Bosshoss stated, and I concur, that no one should be buying these records as an investment backup - buy them because you love them and can afford to keep them indefinitely. Buying to rent (selling off to buy something else that is a flavor of the month), as some folks do, is absurd. These are the ones who will get stuck with their investment and never see anything close to what they paid for it.
Keeping a 'scene' insular is precisely what prevents further discovery and brick-walls anyone who wants to learn more beyond generic aspects. Insularity (if that is a term) is what I met up with when I started back around 1980. I wanted to collect original pressings. Pebbles comps sounded like total shit after the first few spins And Boulders.... However, information as to values, quantities, and other inside knowledge was kept to those more veteran and experienced collectors. I got taken to the cleaners as they say more often than not for the first few years. i guess I had to prove my worth AND learn on my own by being observant and meticulous. By 1986, I was more comfortable shelling out several hundred bucks for a most wanted 45. I did not do that often, either - my selections were carefully considered. And that is what I chose to spend my extra money on - not a new or fancy used car, vacations, musical gear, what have you. The best examples of any genre will continue to sell for stratospheric prices and I find nothing wrong with that. There are many 45s I will never be able to obtain because I cannot afford them. But there are many cheaper examples to collect that I sometimes enjoy even more than the rarified classic.
I guess my 'peeve; would be the fact that far too many people think they have all the answers and can be an expert merely by whatever they find / or can't find via the internet. Experience of decades is usually dismissed as irrelevant, since we now live in the era of immediacy. As exemplified our recent G45 joinee - he's lowered his ransom price by a thousand dollars, but greed always overrules rationality for these insecure types.
As for current prices paid, I agree there are many bargains out there. In my view, the Freedom Five 45 recently achieved near $600 for a VG copy. I would consider that a steal at that price, knowing how rare it is, and how much I had to offer in trade to get my collection copy over a decade ago. And, yes, there are a certain sect of DJ's out there who routinely overpay for a record because their huge scene ego needs to be fed.
Bosshoss stated, and I concur, that no one should be buying these records as an investment backup - buy them because you love them and can afford to keep them indefinitely. Buying to rent (selling off to buy something else that is a flavor of the month), as some folks do, is absurd. These are the ones who will get stuck with their investment and never see anything close to what they paid for it.
paul messis
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2011
- Location
- West Sussex
Do you not have any other passions in life man?? surely spending on the kids isn't wasting cash?? I could spend that sorta money seeing my girlfriend in another country and having fun experiences.
45s are great, I too have forked out hundreds on 45s myself.... but there is a whole world outside record collecting too.
I personally feel its all gotten super stagnant right now.... it just don't feel right to me anymore
I was thinking $700 in UK terms could actually BUY me a super cool 60s car and a host of other things.
I just don't like how the DJ crowd has saturated the market..... it's killing the magic of this music in a way.
Northeastbeast
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2012
No man, no other passions. Just 45s.
In terms of pure materialism vinyl dominates for me. I have a nice car, but it's functional, not fancy, I travel all over the world with work so travel is not a significant spend otherwise for me, I'm a big football fan but I support my local team in the north of Scotland so it's pretty low cost. I don't own a TV, I'm not big into electrical items, I like banging about on an old acoustic guitar, reading 20th century Scottish fiction, I box a little bit, and run, slowly, I spend a lot of time with my family but I'd rather play in the local park than take them to Disney Land, I'm still quite partial to shagging, despite the growing family, I've traded the class As for craft beer, so that's a reduced cost, I'm fairly content on the passion front, to be honest.
I do accept your point to an extent and certainly agree with MTM and BossHoss around those using vinyl to augment their investment portfolio but, in general, I think the positives outweigh the negatives.
I've not actually bought a record on Ebay (auction, at least, I've snagged a few BIN) in over a year. Instead I've made friends both online and in the flesh and used those connections to secure items on my list. I've also made good friends locally and across Europe and Japan thanks to the wider popularity of the music we all love. I even got to play records to literally hundreds of fans in an incredible venue in Tokyo last year. It was frustrating last month to get blown out of the water on the Noblemen. I was about 3rd or 4th in the bidding. But with the money I'd raised to finance my bid (where I was mostly selling stuff I bought 10-15 years ago for 4 times what I paid for it), I got The Answer on White Whale, High Tensions on Hitt and Lyrics on Era, and still had around $1000 left over for other stuff.
So, yeah, Ebay is fucked, it's frustrating to get consistently outbid on big wants that I've coveted for years (see The Illusions, repeatedly) but the wider "scene", the nights out, the friendships, the exposure to more great music, outweighs the inflated prices on one platform for acquiring fresh slabs.
Did you ever get a copy of The Pagans, Baba Yaga, by the way? There's a real nice guy selling one on a FB group just now for $125, which I think is pretty reasonable.
Outside_Lookin_in
G45 Legend
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2014
I think MTM is spot on.
However, although driven by passion, I was also thinking of my purchases as an investment after the initial few years of collecting, as it was the only way I could justify spending so much money on records. That being the case, it doesn't bother me at all now seeing records I own go for ridiculous prices, but I think the norm is bargains rather than huge prices, as the feeding frenzies only seem to occur with certain records which may be in favour at the time - probably once again due to our dj friends.
However, although driven by passion, I was also thinking of my purchases as an investment after the initial few years of collecting, as it was the only way I could justify spending so much money on records. That being the case, it doesn't bother me at all now seeing records I own go for ridiculous prices, but I think the norm is bargains rather than huge prices, as the feeding frenzies only seem to occur with certain records which may be in favour at the time - probably once again due to our dj friends.
paul messis
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2011
- Location
- West Sussex
Did you ever get a copy of The Pagans, Baba Yaga, by the way? There's a real nice guy selling one on a FB group just now for $125, which I think is pretty reasonable.
Yeah I managed to snag a mint Pagans last year thanks great work remembering??
I've myself tend to go for the jugular and email 60s garage musicians themselves, I've had 3 big ones come my way PLUS i've got friends for life, I don't do social media so I know I'm missing out big time on the various Facebook Record groups.... but you win some and lose some.
I also collect 70s punk, 80s indie and 80s post-punk stuff too, so as well as collecting 60s garage its getting like Hitler in world war two, attacking too many sides.
I agree with "Outside" above... I guess this 45 collecting is an investment too.... I also agree its a shame our "DJ fiends" rise the prices on our beloved rock n roll 45s.
I agree with Mike's post above bargains can be found especially when you get into the sub-genres etc.... example, I kinda like teener rock n roll which at times can be known in doo-wop circles, yet for me some of them are killer moody garage cuts.
