Jeffers66
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2011
Thanks for the mention. I'm trying to list garage 45s at least once a month. There's a listing up right now, in fact. The hard part is giving up records that I've had for 40 or so years!
(not another ebay thread)
- Thread starter captainsalty
- Start date
Dave Baldwin
Tennalaga Class
- Joined
- May 5, 2011
- Location
- Deep Texas
Local garage 45 stocks were starting to noticeably 'dry up' in Sacramento back around 1982 or so (lol).
Frantic
G45 Legend
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
I don't know about that since I found loads between 1985-2015
Dave Baldwin
Tennalaga Class
- Joined
- May 5, 2011
- Location
- Deep Texas
As a "relaxed" collector rather than a committed digger, I was literally tripping over cool local 45s back in 1981-83 at joke prices.
The garage 45 market tightened up considerably as the 80s turned into 90s and new sharks began to swim in these waters
(much like "affordable" homes market in the Bay Area began commanding WTF?!? prices as Silicon Valley became ascendant).
cracker
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2019
quite a dust up on recordboy's Shadows 45 yesterday. I was surprised to turn up a copy in NorCal in the past year and a half
I've been curious of late. I think back when this board started/migrated from Garage Punk, the ebay watch must've been 90% board members bidding against each other. I feel like the market died down a bit, maybe because everybody has everything already, but within the last 3-5 years prices are back up high again with some real bloodbaths, both on classics, but also for the kind of difficult obscurities that are good but not really "garage monsters", that used to sell for $3-500.
so nowadays, who do you think the bidding pool is? is it still mostly board members trying to finish out their collections, given up on waiting, or is there a lot of new blood? I'm not sure if I'm just imagining, there seems to be a Euro/UK DJ contingent that maybe aren't on this board, with slightly different tastes, bidding up certain things. but I can't tell if that's 2-3 guys, or if there are dozens of new collectors willing to pay up.
I've been curious of late. I think back when this board started/migrated from Garage Punk, the ebay watch must've been 90% board members bidding against each other. I feel like the market died down a bit, maybe because everybody has everything already, but within the last 3-5 years prices are back up high again with some real bloodbaths, both on classics, but also for the kind of difficult obscurities that are good but not really "garage monsters", that used to sell for $3-500.
so nowadays, who do you think the bidding pool is? is it still mostly board members trying to finish out their collections, given up on waiting, or is there a lot of new blood? I'm not sure if I'm just imagining, there seems to be a Euro/UK DJ contingent that maybe aren't on this board, with slightly different tastes, bidding up certain things. but I can't tell if that's 2-3 guys, or if there are dozens of new collectors willing to pay up.
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
- Location
- The shores of southern CT
The Shadows 45 is an anomaly, the result of two bidders vying for it. I would not consider this record maintaining the 4 figure price paid; a fair value is more like $300 for the condition. This Gold Standard label pressing has a better coupling of tunes. The first label issue on Switch of "Tell Me" is really hard to find (has lotsa room reverb added that is not heard on the Gold Standard version). 'Tho probably less desirable to most as it contains a dull instrumental A-side version of the jazz standard, "Take Five".
To answer the bidding pool query: I believe it is a combination of the pervasive DJ contingent coupled with a small influx of newer collectors coming into the field. There always seems to be that one guy (have not seen a female big spender come along as yet) who has seemingly unlimited financial capability to outbid competing collectors. You will notice several recent ebay wins of what some would consider excessive bid amounts, all won by the same bidder. He has dominated ebay auctions featuring bonafide, rare "monsters". I do not know him personally, but he is only after garage 45s, unlike Mr. Lewis from NYC who can easily afford any 45 he desires regardless of genre category.
The DJ contingent has completely disrupted the garage/psych marketplace. Trying to get a handle on their buying and selling activity is akin to stock market speculation. 20 years ago, a collector could study and make reasonable purchases based upon the marketplace at that moment coupled with past history (number of copies extant, in collections, sales activity per mail order lists, etc.). Unlike today, a dealer would often be much more inclined to put a price on a garage 45 based upon input from knowledgeable people, adjusted accordingly up or down based upon demand for it. Things were much more fluid. Sure, there would be someone who came along and offered 3-5x more than what a 45 sold for in the recent past , but not to the extreme that the DJ contingent has done in recent years.
The big difference between the "high rollers" who came into the collecting fray years back, and the newer bidding pool, from what I have observed, is a complete lack of regard for the condition of the 45. From a logical standpoint, a G plus condition 45 should sell for no more than 10-15% of a Mint minus value, one that can be traced back over time from past sales. However, the DJ oriented buyer has thrown that market concept out the window. In 2021, condition is practically irrelevant; owning the 45 is more important. We can no longer accurately value discs downward price-wise from a near mint origin. If a less than VG copy of the Paragons "Abba" routinely sells for $1,000, does that imply a near mint copy is or should tote a pricetag of 4 X 5 times that amount? No. It might sell to a high roller, but for most people the cost will be too high for their budget, even if they desire a hi-grade copy. Paying high prices for beater copies of well-known classics, hyped "floor fillers", (good or absolutely dreadful), touting a former common $20 disc as a "new scene discovery" that sheeple DJs drive up the price for tenfold seemingly overnight has veered the marketplace to a financial roller-coaster ride. Every DJ collector wants the same 100 discs in their play-box, while great "chairfiller" (undanceable) 45s can now be had for far less than what they sold for in the recent past. A Mint Minus copy of the Maundy Quintet on Paris tower, and essential (IMO) to have in one's collection sold for aa bargain price - less than $200 - a few days ago. It does turn up but rarely in high grade condition. I paid far more for my copy in the same condition.
But ya can't dance to it in your retro-themed abode.
To answer the bidding pool query: I believe it is a combination of the pervasive DJ contingent coupled with a small influx of newer collectors coming into the field. There always seems to be that one guy (have not seen a female big spender come along as yet) who has seemingly unlimited financial capability to outbid competing collectors. You will notice several recent ebay wins of what some would consider excessive bid amounts, all won by the same bidder. He has dominated ebay auctions featuring bonafide, rare "monsters". I do not know him personally, but he is only after garage 45s, unlike Mr. Lewis from NYC who can easily afford any 45 he desires regardless of genre category.
The DJ contingent has completely disrupted the garage/psych marketplace. Trying to get a handle on their buying and selling activity is akin to stock market speculation. 20 years ago, a collector could study and make reasonable purchases based upon the marketplace at that moment coupled with past history (number of copies extant, in collections, sales activity per mail order lists, etc.). Unlike today, a dealer would often be much more inclined to put a price on a garage 45 based upon input from knowledgeable people, adjusted accordingly up or down based upon demand for it. Things were much more fluid. Sure, there would be someone who came along and offered 3-5x more than what a 45 sold for in the recent past , but not to the extreme that the DJ contingent has done in recent years.
The big difference between the "high rollers" who came into the collecting fray years back, and the newer bidding pool, from what I have observed, is a complete lack of regard for the condition of the 45. From a logical standpoint, a G plus condition 45 should sell for no more than 10-15% of a Mint minus value, one that can be traced back over time from past sales. However, the DJ oriented buyer has thrown that market concept out the window. In 2021, condition is practically irrelevant; owning the 45 is more important. We can no longer accurately value discs downward price-wise from a near mint origin. If a less than VG copy of the Paragons "Abba" routinely sells for $1,000, does that imply a near mint copy is or should tote a pricetag of 4 X 5 times that amount? No. It might sell to a high roller, but for most people the cost will be too high for their budget, even if they desire a hi-grade copy. Paying high prices for beater copies of well-known classics, hyped "floor fillers", (good or absolutely dreadful), touting a former common $20 disc as a "new scene discovery" that sheeple DJs drive up the price for tenfold seemingly overnight has veered the marketplace to a financial roller-coaster ride. Every DJ collector wants the same 100 discs in their play-box, while great "chairfiller" (undanceable) 45s can now be had for far less than what they sold for in the recent past. A Mint Minus copy of the Maundy Quintet on Paris tower, and essential (IMO) to have in one's collection sold for aa bargain price - less than $200 - a few days ago. It does turn up but rarely in high grade condition. I paid far more for my copy in the same condition.
But ya can't dance to it in your retro-themed abode.
mr. splendid
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
- Location
- Berlin , Germany
This auction definitely proves your point !
https://www.ebay.com/itm/ORLYN-RECO...Where-Has-My-Summer-Gone-Poppies/402699595707
Dave Baldwin
Tennalaga Class
- Joined
- May 5, 2011
- Location
- Deep Texas
Certainly not my favourite Orlyn...
cracker
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2019
I'm less perplexed by condition. a lot of guys here were around when stock copies were regularly still turning up. but if you weren't around when whatever record turned up, it's pretty much game over now. it's not like any of you are going to sell your copies. given the choice of buying a G condition copy just to have a copy, or waiting 5-10 years for a nicer copy to turn up (and having to contend with other bidders who've also been waiting 5-10 years), I'll go for any copy now if it plays ok.
I guess I could just wait for a board member to die
I guess I could just wait for a board member to die
Heitkotter77
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2011
- Location
- the Woods of Briar
It's all a matter of one's preferences.
There was an old German psych private collector who was nicknamed Mr. Mint. He only wanted mint records (not mint minus, but mint).
You could offer him the rarest unknown gem, He was as obsessed as any other of the psych collectors, but he would still pass on it if it wasn't mint.
Seller: I have a copy of ultra rare Joe Shlabotnik LP for sale.
Mr. Mint: Is it mint?
Seller: No, it's VG+, but almost perfect. Just has a few scuffs.
Mr. Mint: Thank you. I will wait for a mint copy.
Seller: This is one of only two known copies and the better condition one. I tracked down and spoke to every member of the band. They only pressed 10 copies and aside from their own copies, which are all hammered anyway, they had none left. This is the only copy that will ever beavailable.
Mr. Mint: That is okay. I will wait for a mint copy.
Poor Mr. Mint never got a copy.
There was an old German psych private collector who was nicknamed Mr. Mint. He only wanted mint records (not mint minus, but mint).
You could offer him the rarest unknown gem, He was as obsessed as any other of the psych collectors, but he would still pass on it if it wasn't mint.
Seller: I have a copy of ultra rare Joe Shlabotnik LP for sale.
Mr. Mint: Is it mint?
Seller: No, it's VG+, but almost perfect. Just has a few scuffs.
Mr. Mint: Thank you. I will wait for a mint copy.
Seller: This is one of only two known copies and the better condition one. I tracked down and spoke to every member of the band. They only pressed 10 copies and aside from their own copies, which are all hammered anyway, they had none left. This is the only copy that will ever beavailable.
Mr. Mint: That is okay. I will wait for a mint copy.
Poor Mr. Mint never got a copy.
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2011
- Location
- The shores of southern CT
I thought Dave Baldwin was the Mr. Mint
of yore? Or just the 45rpm Mr. Mint
of yore? Or just the 45rpm Mr. Mint
Heitkotter77
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2011
- Location
- the Woods of Briar
I thought Dave Baldwin was the Mr. Mint
of yore? Or just the 45rpm Mr. Mint
Just the 45 rpm version.
Dieter was the 12" Mr. Mint.
captainsalty
Ikon Class
- Joined
- Apr 28, 2011
certainly there's an influx of new garage buyers with money.
i was surprised that in the garage 45 facebook groups, where people routinely pay immense sums for common records, many top players didn't even have a copy of tbm.
i was surprised that in the garage 45 facebook groups, where people routinely pay immense sums for common records, many top players didn't even have a copy of tbm.
cracker
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2019
I'm just curious about this contingent of new blood.
how many people (not on this board) are actively buying from garage Facebook groups? is this like 10 people or 100?
are they mostly just reformed soul/DJ types already used to spending hundreds on records
how many people (not on this board) are actively buying from garage Facebook groups? is this like 10 people or 100?
are they mostly just reformed soul/DJ types already used to spending hundreds on records
undertheclock
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2020
I can imagine. I;m not a seller. I can't even dream of selling records that I have 3 or 4 of that would be highly sought after the second I mentkioned them. And I don't intend to. In fact, I've only sold one record in 30 years--to a friend of ours.
undertheclock
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2020
A possible factor is that people tend to accumulate more money over time, and have to spend less on other things compared to when they were younger.
undertheclock
Mark VII Class
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2020
"The big difference between the "high rollers" who came into the collecting fray years back, and the newer bidding pool, from what I have observed, is a complete lack of regard for the condition of the 45. From a logical standpoint, a G plus condition 45 should sell for no more than 10-15% of a Mint minus value, one that can be traced back over time from past sales. However, the DJ oriented buyer has thrown that market concept out the window. In 2021, condition is practically irrelevant; owning the 45 is more important."
I resemble a corollary of that. If I see a rare garage record I want, and haven't seen it for 25 years, I find I almost ignore condition because I feel I'll never find it again. I would pay the same for a G Daedalus as for an M, for example.
I resemble a corollary of that. If I see a rare garage record I want, and haven't seen it for 25 years, I find I almost ignore condition because I feel I'll never find it again. I would pay the same for a G Daedalus as for an M, for example.
