Shiver me TBMbers! The Great Comp Showdown Thread!

Patrick the Lama said:
The Acid Dreams story is crazy indeed, Sylvain must have spent 1000 hours trying to piece that one together. I'm not sure if you have to bother with pseudonyms nowadays, it was 30+ years ago. I'll let Professor Comp lay it all out, and will only say that I think it's a monster comp, one of the best ever. Man, only a "5" for Music Machine "You'll Love Me Again"? It's their best goddamn 45. And only a "5" for the Vejtables raga fuzz killer? Whew.
Click to expand...

I am revamping Acid Dream #1 and I am SHAKING IN MY GODDAMN SEAT! This is a fuckin sick comp, better than Psychedelic Disaster Whirl even when it comes to hard-core acid punk. Un-fuckin-believable!!
Right now I'm vacuuming the web for a good-sounding version of Beautiful Daze's City Jungle, harder than it should be..not only because it is my and mansson66's favorite, but because it is a monster mind-melting piece of psychetastic WONDER!
 
It was interesting reading all about Acid Dreams earlier in this thread. I had not realized how rare and sought-after it is, because I already have it. It got my long-term memory working overtime and I can add the following for Sylvain and others interested -
I was a Funhouse regular since they started their mail-order lists in the mid-late 70s. I got to know Malcolm G. well (and don't forget Steve Eversley) and spent a large percentage of my spare cash there for the next couple of decades (as well as running up massive phone bills) ... even visited them a coupla times in Margate. Anyway, I nabbed a copy of the original Acid Dreams as soon as it appeared - mine is #29 and is exactly as shown in the photos - slightly mottled red vinyl, LSD-25 red-label-stuck-over-yellow on one side, blank red label on the other, plastic op-art sleeve with track listing on black background on the inside, the 'front' is clear plastic with the stencilled number in yellow on the outside, bottom right corner. Even back then, I kept a list of my records (to try to keep my vinyl collecting habit under control, unsuccessfully) so I can confirm that the original Acid Dreams dates from 1980. I also noted that it was #29 of 100, I assume I got the info about 100 either from Malcolm/Steve or from the blurb in their mail-order list.
I do recall that it appeared not long after Pebbles 3 - The Acid Gallery (1979) , my favourite then and the first purely garage-psych comp. Billy Synth's Psychedelic Unknowns series had just started in '79, with the first 2 volumes as double-EPs, and Dave "Moxie" Gibson's Boulders series would kick off in 1980.
I believe that original copies of Acid Dreams appear so rarely is that it's a keeper, an all-killer-no-filler comp - I've never even thought about parting with mine despite all the tracks reappearing elsewhere. If I was to be hyper-critical, I'd not have included Balloon Farm - imho too poppy compared to the rest.
 
rereading the earlier part of this thread got me digging out some of my oldest comps again.

Yeah, that Magic Cube was maddening - the only reason mine is still intact is that I unhooked the elastic band inside the cube to prevent the darn thing taking my eye out when I tried to remove the flexi disc.

I was already acquiring original 45s from my earliest US contacts and countless dealers - Greg Shaw, Billy Synth, Tim Warren (when he was still in NJ), Vic Figlar, Doug Hanners etc. - but as a foreigner in pre-internet days I found all the good stuff had long gone before I received the lists and managed to get through on the phone .
When "comps" first started appearing I got almost all of them from Funhouse - certainly Acid Dreams and the earliest Pebbles, Boulders, Psych Unknowns. Thanks to Funhouse, I secured copies of Everywhere Chainsaw (mine is #024, no sign of a "B" on my copy) and Everywhere Interferences (#103). I missed out on Changes but eventually picked up an expensive copy many years later ... not long before it was reissued on CD.

I can confirm for Sylvain the existence of Texas P P Vol. II . I have a metal acetate in a plain white sleeve - "TEXAS P P VOL. II" written in biro on the front, along with "#4" in the bottom left corner. On the rear is listed the contents, as follows (all in uppercase and with the mis-spellings) ....
SIDE 1
TRAIN KEPT A ROLLIN - CYNICS
UNCHAIN MY HEART - UNDERTAKERS
WHAT CAN I DO - THE CICADELICS
HATE - PERILS
1523 BLAIR - THE OUTCASTS
SIDE-2
WERE GONNA LOVE THIS WAY - CICADELICS
BAD BOY - FLOYD DAKIL 4
SMOKESTACK LIGHTENING - OUTCASTS
WON'T COME BACK - ZACKARY THACKS
MISTER YOUR A BETTER MAN THAN I - CYNICS

On the standard white acetate labels someone has written "Various Artists" in the space for Artist, "Texas PP-VOL II" for Title, and "Side -1/2" . No date has been entered.
Hope this helps.
 
  • I'm pretty sure Acid Visions (1983) was the only comp in this thread conceived of inside of a prison cell.
  • You don't see Roy C. Ames's name on any labels from the 1960s. He was a guy on the fringes of the Houston music scene. He was a salesman, I think for King Records in Houston, and he was Johnny Winter's manager for a couple of years. I think '64-'66. (That is why Winter is excessively indulged on Acid Visions.) Ames was into R&B -- he was in his late 20s then, so teenage pop/rock music of the period was too juvenile for him. Somehow he got the money together to finance albums from Lightnin' Hopkins, Juke Boy Bonner, T-Bone Walker, and Arnett Cobb, though mysteriously they were not released until years after the actual sessions. The Lightnin' LP was cut in 1968, but didn't come out until 1975. Ames may have been in jail during that time. Discovering that the record business is a ticket to the poorhouse, he began distributing pornographic films, and apparently made a lot of money doing this in the 1970s.
  • In 1983, Ames was in jail again, but was about to be paroled, and needed money. His tapes were stored at ACA Studios in Houston, so he asked the owner if he could find somebody to license them to, so cash could get raised. ACA had just hired Andy Bradley, a young guy from Australia who knew the music, and he in turn contacted Greg Shaw. Shaw was very interested. The deal was that the album would all be from master tapes in Ames's collection. The problem was that when Andy started going through the tapes, there was very little garage-psych. It was mostly R&B. Ames had not made that clear to Shaw.
  • Shaw and Bradley salvaged the album concept by bringing in vinyl from their own collections. Pete Buesnel and Ronnie Bond, who owned the only punk rock record store in Houston, may have helped out here. Shutt/Hanners were not involved. I think most or all of the Texas Flashbacks LPs had already come and gone by then.

  • I guess this was the only comp actually remixed and produced by a studio that had recorded garage bands in the '60s, ACA (though the location had changed by then), including at least one track on the LP. I'm not sure if Cicadelic's LPs were actually remixed at Sumet-Burnet Sound in the 1980s. If so, that would be the other one.
  • It was Shaw who made the special effort to avoid any tracks that had already been comped.

  • The title "Acid Visions" was Shaw's idea, undoubtedly inspired by "Acid Dreams." It was a commercial title but unlike "Acid Dreams" almost nothing on the album was psychedelic at all, thus contributing to the maddening confusion of garage bands with acid bands that continues to this day. Stupid people bought the album and assumed, since it was from the '60s and was called "Acid Visions," all the bands must have been on acid.
  • What set this LP apart from so many others was (a) tapes were used for some tracks, (b) it was not a "limited edition" and was easily available for 7.98 for most of the 1980s at good record stores, and (c) it looked like a professional package and design, not the embarrassing "special needs" 9th grade student design of virtually every other comp of the 1980s. Shaw told people that Acid Visions was one of his best-selling LPs.
  • Pete Buesnel's liner notes were good, but nothing was known about most of these bands, and he repeated some myths that have died hard over the last 30 years.
  • 1 The Great Believers - Comin' Up Fast (Part 1) - From master tape. This is Dave Russell singing with the Johnny Winter Band in late 1966 or early 1967 at ACA Studio in Houston. Ames released this on his Cascade label. MTM says it only came out in 1970, but I think this was actually released in 1967. The 1970 date must come from Ames sending the single out to trade pubs after Winter was on Columbia. Although a great track, Russell and Winter were part of the blue-eyed soul/blues scene in Houston, so this was uncharacteristic of them, which probably explains why it was released under a pseudonym. They didn't want their R&B fans to know they had sold out by making a Top 40 pop single. I don't think Winter ever performed under the name "Great Believers."
  • 2 The Scotty McKay Quintet - The Train Kept A-Rollin' - From vinyl. Obviously Ames did not have this Fort Worth group on tape. Bobby Rambo on lead guitar, not Jimmy Page.
  • 3 A-440 - Torture - From vinyl. One of only two psychedelic tracks on the LP.
  • 4 The Things - I Don't Believe It - Unissued from tape. Ames claimed to have produced this Houston band. If that's true, he deserved to have his ass kicked for not releasing this and the track on Side 2 in 1967. The group has never been found.


  • 5 The Stoics - Enough Of What I Need - From vinyl? The Stoics' 45 was the major discovery of Acid Visions. Shutt either didn't have a copy, or didn't know about it when compiling Texas Flashbacks. For years, I thought this was from the master tape, because when I interviewed Roy Ames years later, he showed me the Stoics master tape. However, now I believe this was dubbed from vinyl and cleaned up by Andy Bradley on the mixing board. Ames's tape raid of Jones Sound's vault only came after he got out of jail most likely, which means that while the Stoics master exists, it has never been reissued from tape. Unfortunately, the liner notes repeat the myth that only 150 copies were pressed, when in reality, it was probably 500. Bill Ash from the band had a box or two of 25-50 copies and he probably supplied the one for this album.

  • 6 Satori - Time Machine - From vinyl. The other psychedelic track on Acid Visions. One of several mysteries here is why they left off "1000 Micrograms of Love," which wouldn't appear on a comp until three years later. The master tape was located in the early 2000s.

  • 7 Neal Ford & The Ramadas - Life Is So Tough - From vinyl? Ames insisted that this lame 1964 track be on the album because Neal Ford and the Fanatics were the top band in Houston and he thought if he had Neal on the album, all of his old fans would buy it. That shows you how out of touch with the scene Ames was. Of course, nobody actually involved in the '60s scene in Houston bought Acid Visions.




  • Side 2
  • 1 Roy Head & The Great Believers - Easy Lovin' Girl - Unissued from master tape. I'm guessing this was another one Ames insisted on including over Shaw's objections. Totally out of place here, this is more blue-eyed soul guys having a piss at rock and roll.

  • 2 Johnny Winter - Birds Can't Row Boats (The Statue) - Unissued from master tape. This has caused no end of confusion, since the track is not Johnny's Pacemaker single at all, nor a "slightly different LP track," but the backing track overdubbed with new vocals (not by Winter) and lyrics. The new song is titled "The Statue" and is obviously unfinished and therefore pointless. Had Winter's actual track been used, it could have been called psych, but once again, that track is more of a novelty/pisstake at a current trend from a soul/blues singer, not an actual psych single.

  • 3 The Pandas - Walk - From vinyl? The other major discovery of Acid Visions. The vocals are "heavy" enough for this to be considered psych by some, but we now know this dates from 1966, and the Pandas were not a psych band at all. The uncharacteristic-for-a-garage-band baritone vocals prevented this from being as revered as the Stoics, since the guitarist here blows away the Stoics.

  • 4 The Bad Roads - Blue Girl - From vinyl? Shaw screwed up here, since it had already appeared on Pebbles Vol. 9, and as we now know, the group was from Louisiana.


  • 5 The Things - In Your Soul - Unissued from master tape. Another great track from these unknowns. The organ parts on this are brilliant.

  • 6 The Stoics - Hate - From vinyl? Not sure why Shaw allowed this to buried at the end of Side 2.

  • 7 Amos Boynton & The ABCs - The Ballad Of Bertha Glutz - Unissued from master tape. Yet ANOTHER blue-eyed soul "rock" pisstake from Winter and company, which I'm sure Shaw only grudgingly left on at Ames's insistence, or to salvage something from the contract he signed. This gives the false impression that Winter was somehow an influence on the garage-psych scene in Houston, when he actually wasn't. Winter's overexposure on this LP is purely because of Ames having the tapes and thinking they should be issued.

  • All in all, a very uneven and eccentric album, eclectic in a bad way, a compromise between people with very different perspectives, Ames and Shaw. This compromise makes Acid Visions the oddity among the early '80s comps. The Roy Head and Amos Boynton tracks should have never been included at all, nor should "Life is So Tough" or "The Statue." Jettison those four tracks and replace them with even just average 1966 tracks and this would have been a great LP from start to finish.

  • Flower Bomb Songs' web page for Acid Visions:

  • http://expo67-cavestones.blogspot.com/search/label/Acid Visions
 
Did anybody actually buy these "limited editions" at record stores? The only distribution I was aware of was Midnight Records' catalog, where they would be listed as "rare" or "OOP" (out of print) and priced at two or three times the price of a regular LP. This was in the late 1980s. That was a big reason why BFTG steamrolled over most comps in influence and popularity. They were easily obtainable for 7.98 at good record stores or directly from Crypt. I refused to pay 19.98 for a comp when good quality original singles were selling for the same price. Plus the special needs cover designs were about as attractive to me as Lena the Hyena. I'm glad these were not sold in stores. I would have been too embarrassed to have been seen with them at any price.
 
Nearly every comp from that time period (early 1980 onward) was available to buy at Capitol Record shop in Hartford, CT. Not sure what I had to fork over for Acid Visions but it was certainly not a JD / Midnight Records ransom sticker price.
 
Most of them from that time frame showed up at Oarfolkjokeopus in Minneapolis. Pretty sure that the Root 66 comp hit the street at under 10 bucks, even though it was probably the only release ever on the highly esteemed PARAQUAT label!
 
p1070327o.jpg

p1070328w.jpg
[/quote]

It's been years since I've seen that, as I threw the cover away very soon after obtaining my copy. (As I did with any cover drawn by Sloane, and several other Special Needs covers of the period.) A test pressing of this is dated May 10, 1988, the same month I graduated high school.

Unlike Volume 1, Acid Visions Volume 2 was entirely compiled by Ames. So the quality control department of Shaw and Bradley was gone this time. Though Vol. 1 had some problems, at least Shaw managed to keep the time frame focused on 1966-67 only. Not so Vol. 2, for better and worse.

If Vol. 1 was such a great success, why did it take five years to issue a second volume? I suspect Ames simply didn't have enough tapes or even vinyl. He always presented himself as a producer from the sixties, which was partially true, but only in a very limited sense. He gave the impression that he produced a lot more than he really did, and what he did produce was some lame R&B and blue-eyed soul/rock.

After 1983, Ames acquired tapes both from the Jones Sound vault and the Charlie Booth estate, among others, and some tracks here are drawn from those sources, i.e. they were for the most part not produced by Ames.

This was probably the first comp to boldly claim that it was "Digitally Mastered From the Original Master Tapes" -- "digitally mastered" was a new marketing gimmick starting to appear on every major label reissue at the time -- which, like Volume 1, was only a half-truth.

Fanatics - I Can't Believe (Woman) - From tape. One of two great discoveries on the LP. We now know this November, 1966, track was recorded with several other unissued goodies ("Good Men," "I Can't Go On") that wouldn't surface for another seven years. Ames of course had no idea this was the Zombies' "Woman," which is why it's on here and You Tube as "I Can't Believe."

Fanatics - I Will Not Be Lonely - From vinyl. The master tape to this was only discovered a couple of years ago. Already a well-known track by this time since it had appeared on Flashbacks. So already the listener knows that no attempt is being made to avoid duplicates from previous comps, unlike Vol. 1.

Sherwoods - Bless Me Woman - From tape. From 1970? Not much to say about this Grand Funk sounding outtake.

Sherwoods - I Know You Cried - From tape? Another dupe from Flashbacks.

Thursday's Children - You'll Never Be My Girl - From tape (I think). A dupe from Pebbles Vol. 5. I think Ames acquired some tapes from the guy who owned Paradise, hence the appearance of this and the Warlocks on Side 2.

BLC - I Don't Wanna Go - From tape? The other great discovery on this album. The first 10 seconds of the song (heard on the 45) are chopped off here, undoubtedly an Amesian edit to "improve" the song. Both BLC singles have proved impossible to date with precision, but a range within 1968-70 is most likely. This is one of those unusual singles that appeals to both hardcore garage heads and hardcore psych heads.

Things - Loveless Lover - From tape. Unissued from the same session as Vol. 1's "In Your Soul." The weakest of their four tracks, but it's good to have their entire 1967 session released.

Space Cadets - Nothing Can Stand in My Way - From tape. Unissued. Ames claimed to have produced this band, so they were another group (like the Things) that got screwed out of having a release at the time of the session. 1969-70 era, hard rock. R&R

Space Cadets - Love-Itis - From tape. The Harvey Scales tune? I can't remember. I do remember hating it though.

Things - Another Girl Like You - From tape. Fourth and last song from their only session. Another good one.

Warlocks - Life's a Misery - From tape (I think). Not bad, but not as good as their track on Flashbacks.

Homer - Dandelion Wine - From vinyl. 1969-70. I hated this Bubble Puppy-inspired track in 1988, but I like it now. This is Galen Niles from the Outcasts.

Homer - Sunrise - From vinyl.

Unknowns - Outside Looking In - From tape? I can't imagine how Ames could have acquired this on tape, but of course if he had the vinyl he would've known this was the Bad Roads' "Too Bad." Another dupe from Pebbles.

Four duplicates, and a wide range of dates this time, from early 1965 to 1970.
I suppose it would have been a more satisfying album had it been programmed in chronological order, but that level of thought was beyond Ames. To his ears this was all just mindless hippie garbage.

"Another Girl Like You" with digital reverb crap added
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwWbkZTq_jk
 
After saying that the Stoics 45 had never been reissued from the master, I found this Acid Visions Collectables CD from the 1990s which definitely used the master. The vocal/tambourine track is much clearer here than on the single, or on Acid Vol. 1. Unfortunately, like every other track here, amateur digital "remixing" screws it up.

Starts at 9:44

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFbJWCD3XDo
 
The title "Acid Visions" was Shaw's idea, undoubtedly inspired by "Acid Dreams." It was a commercial title but unlike "Acid Dreams" almost nothing on the album was psychedelic at all, thus contributing to the maddening confusion of garage bands with acid bands that continues to this day. Stupid people bought the album and assumed, since it was from the '60s and was called "Acid Visions," all the bands must have been on acid.
Click to expand...

smiley-good-post-sign.gif
 
Hate it when those two categories are grouped into one...almost as much as when garage is confused with psychedelic pop (as happens quite often on the "60s Psych Pop Treasures" online comp series). They're related, but certainly not the same...
 
Ok,finally got my vinyl copies of BFTG 9 + 10 from Off the Hip records (easily the best record shop in my town-it's like going to a record shop from the 80s-au go-go,gaslight,the 'old' missing link before they all closed down) in melbourne...anyway i'm just curious has anybody done the 'math' on how these comps rate?
 
H
Patrick the Lama said:
I didn't post in that thread, but a lot of the years given in GG's original draft (first post) are incorrect; in general they are 1-2 years too late. As an example, Psychedelic Unknowns came out in 1979 for a fact, since it was reviewed or at least mentioned in one of the earliest issues of Kicks magazine from that year. Pebbles vol 3 was also in '79. Boulders vol 1 I believe has a "1980" date on the sleeve, or is it "1979"? Anyway, easy to check.

The true professor of garage comps is Sylvain in Switzerland, not sure if he's in this forum though.
Click to expand...
He sure is
 
stevo3199 said:
Ok,finally got my vinyl copies of BFTG 9 + 10 [...] i'm just curious has anybody done the 'math' on how these comps rate?
Click to expand...

These two comps have been blowing my mind during the past couple of weeks. Two of the finest comps I've ever heard. A total assault to the ears.

I've been checking up some of the tunes in TBM and have often been surprised at the "low" ratings some of my fave songs on the comps recieved. I know that "6" is supposed to be a good song, but some of the 6's and 5's and even the one "4" rated tune have climbed high among my all-time fave tunes. That GMC & The Arcells tune is utter, utter crap though.

Anyway, below are the numbers.

-------------------------

BACK FROM THE GRAVE vol. 9

6 - The Pastels - Circuit Breaker
6 - The Warlocks - Beware
5 - The Emeralds - Like Father Like Son
6 - The Turncoats - Something Better
6 - The Classics - I'm Hurtin'
6 - The Raevins - The Edge of Time
6 - Lord Charles & The Prophets - Ask Me No Questions
6 - The Shakles - Whizz #7
5 - Knoll Allen & The Noble Savages - Animal
6 - The Starfyres - No Room for Your Love

unrated:
The Why-Nots - Tamborine

not listed:
The High Spirits - It's Alright with Me
The Gentlemen - It's a Cry'n Shame (early version)
Unknown Group - When I Feel Better
The Donshires - Sad and Blue

-------------------------

BACK FROM THE GRAVE vol. 10

7 - James Bond & The Agents - Wild Angel
8 - John English III & The Heathens - I Need You Near
8 - The Expressions - Return to Innocence
6 - The Orphans - Without You
6 - The Sires - Don't Look Now
6 - It's Them (TTHHEMM) - Baby (I Still Want Your Lovin')
6 - The Orphans - Hey Gyp
4 - South's Soul - Lost
7 - The Hotbeats - Listen
6 - The Hard Times - Mr. Rolling Stone
8 - Four More - Problem Child
6 - The Color - Young Miss Larsen

unrated:
Nobody's Children - Mother's Tin Moustache

not listed:
The Four - 69
GMC & The Arcells - The Witch

-------------------------
 
Sebastian said:
I've been checking up some of the tunes in TBM and have often been surprised at the "low" ratings some of my fave songs on the comps recieved. I know that "6" is supposed to be a good song, but some of the 6's and 5's and even the one "4" rated tune have climbed high among my all-time fave tunes.
Click to expand...

I think the ratings in combination with the song descriptions do a great job of giving you an idea if the song might interest you or not . I don't think the ratings can , or are intended to , substitute for personal taste .
I for example have a dislike for certain vocal and guitar stylings found mostly on later 60's recordings . A bunch of these songs are getting ratings of 6 and higher in TBM , which means that apparently not many people out there share my dislike .
 
You must log in or register to reply here.